Podcast 127 – Cryx Cry-a-sode!

Okay, we didn’t REALLY cry that much. And to be completely honest, Cryx is still super-scary and very powerful… don’t believe me?

Give this OVER 5 HOUR Faction review a listen, and then tell us all the things we got wrong!

Just don’t talk to us about Bane Riders. Ugh.

Direct Download

Advanced warning, folks… Nick’s audio quality around the 4-6 minute mark is a little sketchy. Thankfully, it clears up very quickly (basically being awful while we talk about Barathram, and then cleaning up), but I couldn’t recover those few minutes. Hopefully the next 5 hours of audio make up for it.

As always, let us know what we got wrong! Thanks for listening!

15 thoughts on “Podcast 127 – Cryx Cry-a-sode!

  1. Funny side note (I’ll comment on more models once I’ve finished listening to the whole thing), but Cygnar can get a 6 point ARM swing if they want to as well.

    • Are we talking in-Faction, or using Mercs? Because Ragman, A&H, and Gorman definitely manage it… as for in-Faction, we have Maddox’s Feat for +3 or a handful of +2 buffs (Positive Charge, Lightning Shroud, Disruption Field…). But I don’t think any in-Faction option can stack ’em.

  2. Just wanted to point out, that I find it funny hearing someone who plays Cygnar and has access to the Thunderhead pulse, complain about auto hitting weapons 🙂

    Also, listening to you guys try and find synergies between some of these Cryx items was entertaining, and some of the words you used sums up a lot of Cryx players feelings with the changes in mk3.

    Anyway, I still thought you guys did a decent job (considering neither of you guys play Cryx, and you haven’t faced them very much in the new edition), and I look forward to the rest of the faction episodes.

    • I’ve been getting some grief on Twitter about complaining about auto-hitting as a Cygnar player. Let me just say: WWWAAAAAAAHHHH!

      Sorry, sorry. My inner Swan needs airing out occasionally. ^_^

      I’m glad we managed to get some stuff right, at least. And I have played against Cryx a half dozen times.

      Only WarMachine Faction remaining is Convergence! Woo! And then on to Hordes!

      • The thing about Biles is, why would I take them? Now that they no longer do massive damage they exist primarily to counter high defence infantry. At least that’s what the auto-hitting suggest. I suppose they can diversify into super-high arm single wound infantry via Corrosion as well.

        They face a couple of challenges to get into a list. First, they are slow (spd5) and they got super victim stats (def 10, arm 13). They take a while to get in position and they die to everything.
        Second, I’m probably already packing Satyxis Raiders. Am I really going to need more infantry clearing than that? And if I do, why don’t I bring Overlords instead? Overlords are cheaper (8 v 9) and although you only get 3, they have Stealth, Pathfinder, way better stats, 5 boxes, Ignore Line of Sight, the same spray, only they trade corrosion for it being a spell, magic ability 7 and they don’t die when they attack.

        So they can deliver themselves, they can exploit terrain, they bring magic weapons (although Cryx have a ton of them these days) and they can probably hit 90% of infantry just fine?

        And of course the current meta is heavily against them as well. Lots of shooting and less infantry for them to clear.

        Someone did a count of what the Cryx players are bringing to the WTC. There are a single min bile unit in total between 58 lists.

        I own a unit of Biles, but I can’t see a justification for bringing them currently. Shame really, as they were so fun to paint. I was kind a hoping PP got rid of the silly purge and instead gave them a usable normal attack, but at rat 3 you are at 50% chance of hitting Def 10!

      • Those are all accurate statements about the Biles… and *yet*…
        The Bile Purge is POW12 base, right? Well, toss in anything with Dark Shroud and suddenly it’s POW14 (which is *almost* as good as a boosted POW12). That will put a hurt on light warjacks, clear most buffed Infantry (my Stormblades at max-buff are ARM20, which will die 50% of the time to POW14s), and mulch high-DEF.
        I play Trenchers in almost all my Cygnar lists. DEF17 against Ranged is damn good, and Immunity to Blast is fantastic… oh wait… the Biles ignore both of those.

        Now, that’s not to say you’re wrong, obviously. Using Biles against a light warjack isn’t a good trade unless you somehow manage to hit multiple warjacks each purge. But I think they still have a place, and a warcaster that can deliver them (Witch Coven, anyone with Occultation, a unit of Satyxis Gunmages to make clouds on the approach…) WILL still get work out of them. But, like you mentioned, their main roll (wiping out swathes of infantry) isn’t as big of a need right now.

        But they’re still terrifying. Thunderhead, who has a shorter-range auto-hitting pulse is terrifying on his own, and he can do this auto-hit trick ONCE (and it still misses Stealth at over 5″ away), and he costs like a million points.

        They suffer from the “Cryx Effect”, in that they’re still GOOD, but they’re not the utter terrors they once were. But we will see if the meta grows to give them a place or not… I suspect it will!

      • Ahh, I think I see some of the reason for different opinion. To continue with the Trencher example almost none of the tools I’d use to remove the Trenchers would care that they are dug in/in a cloud. But thats because I’m not playing on shooting them. Preferred option would be to send some Satyxis into them. Either flavour would do just fine. Alternatively I’ll probably use sprays. Overlords, Biles, War Witch Sirens (by far the most likely of then to be in the list) or spells.

        Now if you could move them out of the clouds I’m in a lot more trouble, but an advance unit of infantry inside the clouds will not enjoy Raiders. I’d be much more worried about both flavour of cavalry. They will cause way more trouble and be much harder to deal with and most of the aforementioned solutions won’t really work against them.. I think the best bet against Stormlances might be trying to get a Slayer into them, will sadly likely have to be after they already destroyed something though. As for the murder ponies, hope my opponent makes a mistake and I can catch them?

      • @Gorbad. Here’s 1 situation. Biles destory Helynna feated Iron Zealed Sentinels. If high-ARM single wound models are running rampant in your meta Biles could be pretty baller. That’s not exactly a far-fetched situation either but apparently none of the WTC players thought they were worth it. So. ¯_(ツ)_/¯

      • Oh I could totally be wrong about it too. I’m certainly not the best cryx player in the world (just an opinionated one that listens to the show!) and the meta is still very young. The high arm single wound infantry is probably their best use case really. I have actually been in a situation where I was looking at sentinels and going “huh, not even worth attacking them, it will just make things worse”. In the end I jammed them with a few Raiders and kept them on flank.

        I think the real problems Biles face is that they need help. Unless you have a plan for delivering them they won’t make it (against many lists). 10/13 is just bad. But so many things in Cryx needs help getting into range and Biles no longer do the massive damage they used to. So justifying helping them rather than say a unit of Banes or a heavy etc is harder. It’s also compounded by somewhat of a change in Cryx. It’s no longer a faction that needs help hitting. If I look at my lists they super accurate. MAT 7 and 8 for most models (effectively). I can almost certainly hit you as often as I want to.

        I can see Biles making a return if the meta changes to lots of high single wound infantry and less shooting. Actually maybe just the last bit would do. Or if Cryx got better tech to get across the table. That’s challenge #1 at the moment, don’t get shot off the table.

  3. Thought this was very interesting. Makrar made a count of all the Cryx lists at the WTC and what they contain.(here: http://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?260996-Cryx-at-the-WTC&p=3672702&viewfull=1#post3672702)
    Thought it would be interesting to match it against expectations, both yours and mine.

    A couple of interesting points. Much less Venethrax than I expected. But more SKarlocks, more Seethers and more MechThralls than I expected to see as well. It is interesting that Croe’s is the 2nd most common infantry unit though. And Wrong Eye the 5th most common Jack/Beast.

    Also, in 58 lists only Raiders are really making a strong showing. I mean, between all the lists there is only a total of 76 MechThralls. Thats not even 1.5 mechthrall in each list! And that’s the second most common Cryx unit.

    Lord Exhumator Scaverous – 10
    Warwitch Deneghra – 9
    The Witch Coven of Garlghast – 8
    Asphyxious the Hellbringer – 7
    Pirate Queen Skarre – 6
    Goreshade the Bastard – 5
    Skarre, Queen of the Broken Coast – 4
    Lich Lord Terminus – 3
    Lich Lord Venethrax – 3
    Bane Witch Agathia – 1
    Goreshade the Cursed – 1
    Master Necrotech Mortenebra – 1
    Captain Aiakos – 0
    Deneghra, the Soul Weaver – 0
    Goreshade, Lord of Ruin – 0
    Iron Lich Asphyxious – 0
    Lich Lord Asphyxious – 0
    Sturgis the Corrupted – 0
    Wraith Witch Deneghra – 0

    Warcaster Attachments
    The Withershadow Combine – 19
    Skarlock Thrall – 13

    Deathripper – 60
    Stalker – 29
    Slayer – 25
    Kraken – 17
    Inflictor – 14
    Barathrum – 12
    Nightmare – 12
    Malice – 9
    Seether – 8
    Nightwretch – 7
    Erebus – 6
    Cankerworm – 6
    Scavenger – 6
    Ripjaw – 5
    Deathjack – 5
    Desecrator – 3
    Harrower – 3
    Leviathan – 3
    Defiler – 1
    Sepulcher – 1
    Corrupter – 0
    Reaper – 0
    Helldiver – 0
    Shrike – 0
    Total – 232 (18 Colossal’s, 100 Heavy Warjacks and 114 Light Warjacks)

    Battle Engines
    Wraith Engine – 2

    Satyxis Raiders (Max) – 39
    Mechanithralls – 10 (6 Min and 4 Max)
    Bane Warriors – 9 (6 Max and 3 min)
    Satyxis Blood Witches – 8 (5 Min and 3 Max)
    Necrosurgeon & Stitch Thralls – 7
    Soulhunters – 6 (5 Max and 1 Min)
    Bane Knights (Max) – 5
    Blackbane’s Ghost Raiders – 4 (2 Max and 2 Min)
    Cephalyx Overlords – 4
    Bane Riders (Max) – 2
    Black Ogrun Boarding Party (Max) – 2
    Bile Thralls (Min) – 1
    Carrion Thralls (Max) – 1
    Revenant Crew of the Atramentous (Min) – 1
    Cephalyx Mind Slaver & Drudges – 0
    Bloodgorgers – 0
    Cephalyx Mind Slaver & Drudges – 0
    Revenant Cannon Crew – 0
    Total – 99 (53 Living units and 46 Undead units)

    Unit Attachments
    Satyxis Raider Sea Witch – 39
    Brute Thrall – 14
    Satyxis Blood Hag – 7
    Revenant Crew Rifleman – 3
    Skarlock Commander – 3
    Bane Warrior Officer & Standard – 1
    Total – 67

    Warwitch Siren – 28
    Machine Wraith – 26
    Necrotech – 20
    Soul Trapper – 18
    Aiakos, Scourge of the Meredius – 12
    Darragh Wrathe – 11
    Scrap Thralls – 8
    Bloat Thrall – 7
    Bane Lord Tartarus – 5
    Satyxis Raider Captain – 5
    Bloat Thrall Overseer Mobius – 4
    Pistol Wraith – 2
    Captain Rengrave – 1
    General Gerlak Slaughterborn – 0
    Iron Lich Overseer – 0
    Total – 147

    Mercenaries and Minions

    Wrong Eye & Snapjaw – 15
    Rorsh & Brine – 1

    Croe’s Cutthroats (Max) – 12
    Cylena Raefyll & Nyss Hunters – 5
    Press Gangers (Max) – 2
    The Devil’s Shadow Mutineers – Mar, Morland & Zira – 2
    Sea Dog Pirates (Max) – 1
    Total – 22

    Unit Attachments
    Mr. Walls, The Quartermaster – 1

    Ragman – 11
    Gorman Di Wulfe, Rogue Alchemist – 7
    Saxon Orrik – 6
    Orin Midwinter, Rogue Inquisitor – 5
    Bosun Grogspar – 1
    Doc Killingsworth – 1
    Lord Rockbottom – 1
    Ogrun Bokur – 1
    Total – 33

    Bunker – 26
    Fuel Cache – 15
    Stockpile – 5
    Arcane Wonder – 4
    Effigy of Valor – 4
    No Objective Listed – 3
    Armory – 1

    Deneghra1 & Witch Coven1 – 3
    Scaverous1 & Skarre1 – 3
    Asphyxious3 & Skarre2 – 2
    Asphyxious3 & Witch Coven1 – 2
    Deneghra1 & Scaverous1 – 2
    Scaverous1 & Venethrax1 – 2
    Skarre1 & Witch Coven1 – 2
    Agathia1 & Goreshade1 – 1
    Asphyxious3 & Deneghra1 – 1
    Asphyxious3 & Skarre1 – 1
    Asphyxious3 & Terminus1 – 1
    Deneghra1 & Goreshade1 – 1
    Deneghra1 & Terminus1 – 1
    Deneghra1 & Venethrax1 – 1
    Goreshade1 & Goreshade2 – 1
    Goreshade1 & Mortenebra1 – 1
    Goreshade1 & Scaverous1 – 1
    Scaverous1 & Skarre2 – 1
    Scaverous1 & Terminus1 – 1
    Skarre2 & Witch Coven1 – 1

    • Thank you for sharing! That’s awesome.

      I just can’t believe ANYONE took the Wraith Engine. Or Bane Riders! Sure, it’s only 2 of ’em each… but still! That’s insane.

      Just goes to show you that everything is still playable… no matter how awful they may be…

      Wraith Engines!? Seriously?

    • This is really interesting. Thanks for posting.

      I almost did a spit-take on how overwhelming the number of lists that had Satyxis Radiers Vs. the next most numerous unit mechanithralls 39-10. (or technically Croes)

      I want to do this for my factions now.

      • I know, it’s a bit silly. If my count is correct in terms of units and counting attachments there are 322 undead models of all types between all the lists. There are 429 Satyxis Raiders alone. So if you lines all the models up there are just over 100 more Satyxis Raiders than all undead units combined.

        It could be that we are just not seeing it yet, but I don’t think PP did very well with internal balance in Cryx. At least when it comes to units and Soloes. Jacks and casters seems reasonable fine actually.

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